Revolutions

This thread has confused me even more than I already was:spangled:

they did say before the second one came out it was to be a matrix within a matrix.....so whats stopping the third one being a matrix within a matrix within a matrix, after all, the matrix is just a computer program isnt it?? with rules that neo can bend (or hacked as he is a hacker), little programs written by the machines which it showed you when that woman ate that piece of cake and she got all hot and flustered. So, is this not just some simple computer game?? with each matrix being a fresh level in the game? and Neo is the star, moving up each level each time he wins "WELL DONE NEO, YOU HAVE ADVANCED TO LEVEL 3".

oh and Smith is his arch enemy....

altho on a documentary of the making of revolutions it did say neo and smith were like positive and negative forces, good and evil, and in order to get the right balance and for everything to exist, they BOTH had to exist... sounds a bit like like a religion to me or Feng Shui. I dunno, just things that have floated round my head...make of them what you wish.

agreed rob, in fact, if you watch the first one again, where he captures morpheus and asks the other agents to leave him alone with him, he speaks about being 'fed up' on a personal level and wants 'out' and the only way he can do it is to get to zion...so for me, isnt this a bit of his OWN artificial intelligence, being a program and all. Then in the second one, he actually acts upon it and again its shown he wants things for himself and is sick of the 'system'.

I really want to go and c it now! I didnt get reloaded until at least the third time so no doubt this one will be a mind teaser!

fizz is right, smith is neo's opposite. but why does he want to get to zion? thats the problem. he's also a problem for the architect - he's a rogue program. but somethings different in him...

I'm going to see it Friday night now that Fusion is cancelled

in the first one, he compares humans to a virus... but infact in the 2nd and 3rd it's him thats more like the virus, mutating and spreading. he's a bad man. no one is safe.

Got this off another board n thought it might be of interest. I aint read it cos i dont wana spoil the film b4 i see it. Any how see if it fits in with what you think.

In two parts cos its huge


With the upcoming release of the final installment of the Matrix trilogy somepeople as I was maybe confused after watching the second. Here is one persons explaination of the trilogy, its quite long but worth the read - proper headfuck material like:

Matrix Reloaded - Explained...
By Jason Payne


Zion is a program, just like the Matrix. How is Neo able to figure out
that he is able to stop the sentinels in Zion near the end of the film?
The spoon given to him earlier. It had obviously been bent loads, but
how outside the Matrix?? This gave Neo the inspiration and the
understanding that Zion is still a matrix.



BM__The_One_explainedThe One explained

"The One" is a program, but has to be "attached" to someone in the Matrix.
So Mr. Anderson got it in the 6th version of theM atrix. Then "The One"
program's purpose is to allow Zion to be destroyed then to rebuild it. The
reason for this is because of anomalies - the 1% of humans that don't accept
the Matrix.
These are all brought out of the< BR>Matrix program and into the Zion
program by the "Morpheus" program and< BR>other similar "ship captain"
programs. Then once all the anomalies are< BR>out of the Matrix (and in
Zion), that is the time for Zion to be destroyed, thus killing all the
anomalies off. The Matrix is then upgraded, thus creating the next version
of the Matrix, but Zion must be rebuilt so that the next lot of anomalies
can be brought out again so< BR>that they can be destroyed. This is the
feedback-loop, and is the reason to retain a handful of people so that Zion
can be rebuilt. So this is< BR>why Neo said the prophecy was a lie - the
One's purpose was not to end< BR>the war as the prophecy stated.

Unfortunately, "The One" program must be re-used each time, or copied, so it
can be "attached" to a new anomaly inside the Matrix. So what happens to the
old "The One" program? It faces deletion, and as the Oracle explained, it
goes into exile instead, just like the French bloke (the Merovingian) did.
He was the first One (probably from the second< BR>version of the Matrix),
and once he fulfilled his duty, he became an exile program and "abdicated"
his "Oneness" by choosing Persephone and< BR>power. This is evident in the
bogs when Persephone asks Neo to kiss her.
She says she wants him to kiss her so she can feel what it is like again to
be kissed by something close to human, just like the Merovingian used to be.
Then she says to Trinity that she envies her, but that these things are not
meant to last. So the Merovingian used to be just like< BR>Neo - a One -
thus proving further the feedback-loop explained earlier.< /FONT>


The correct door in the Architect's room

Now there are two possibilities here:

1. All the previous One's chose the right door allowing a "temporary
dissemination" of their code into the Matrix (i.e., the code
they "carry" thus indicating Neo is indeed human), then he must select
(unplug) 23 people from the Matrix to rebuild Zion. This takes away the
possibility that stories from previous rebuilds of Zion will be carried
through. But Morpheus indicated in thef irst Matrix that this is the case
anyway.
He said, "there was a man born inside, able to change things, it was he who
freed the first of us," -b asically the One previous to Neo. And this proves
that the previous One chose the right door also. Neo's purpose is also to
choose the right door, but he does not because he faces deletion afterwards
and has the choice of going into exile - programs choosing to go into exile
is the one thing that can't be accounted for in program parameters. Thus, he
chooses the left< BR>door instead this time. How was Neo able to choose the
other door?
Because of his extreme willpower? - Even the Architect indicated that<
BR>he'd noticed this - "Interesting. That was quicker than the others." Or<
BR>more likely, because the Oracle upgraded his coding with the candy on<
BR>the park bench. The candy/cookie was a method to change the One's
program. She said he has made a believer out of her - this is quite
human-like and perhaps the previous One's didn't accept the upgrade candy,
now she has hope... hope that Neo will finally choose the other< BR>door.

2. All the previous One's chose the left door, saving Trinity and letting
Zion fall. So this time is no different. But the Architect does say, "You
are here because Zion is about to be destroyed. Its every living inhabitant
terminated, its entire existence eradicated," and also, "this will be the
sixth time we have destroyed it, and we have become exceedingly efficient at
it," - assuming the Architect isn't lying, then they have already destroyed
Zion (i.e., Zion has fallen) five times - i.e., the result of going through
the left door.

Morpheus and Trinity are programs. Morpheus's purpose was to find the One
and deliver him to the Architect. Trinity's purpose is to control the One by
getting in love with him. Trinity is supposed to be the mother of the new
One every time the Matrix is Reloaded. That's why the sex scene was so
important and why she was named Trinity.

The Architect says, "she is going to die, and there is nothing that you can
do to stop it." He was correct though because she did die just like Neo did
in the first Matrix (Oracle said he or Morpheus would, and she didn't lie,
but he came back to life). Trinity dies, butc omes back to life (we are
using medical definition of death in all this of course!).

The Architect has already laid down an ultimatum for Neo choosing the
left door:

The Architect - "Failure to comply with this process will result in a
cataclysmic system crash killing everyone connected to the matrix, which
coupled with the extermination of Zion will ultimately result in the
extinction of the entire human race."

Neo - "You won't let it happen, you can't. You need human beings to
survive."

The Architect - "There are levels of survival we are prepared to accept.
However, the relevant issue is whether or not you are ready to accept the
responsibility for the death of every human being in this world."

Looking at this further, the Architect does say "coupled" with the
extermination of Zion will the human race be exterminated. So he says
everyone connected to the Matrix will die, but if Zion is not exterminated,
the human race will not necessarily die. Also, there is likely to be a
time-window between not going through the rightd oor, and the cataclysmic
crash, thus allowing Neo to unplug as many asp ossible from the Matrix, then
those people won't die. This will be thes tart of the next Zion. As for the
Matrix, a cataclysmic crash doesn't mean the end of the Matrix - just needs
rebooting or reloading!


Agent Smith explained

Agent Smith is the only "human" in this world. He's the one spreading
himself like a virus replicating himself over and over until the Matrix will
finally get overloaded and fail. Smith is the one who wants to get out of
the Matrix for good. He said so in the first Matrix, "I must get out of
here, I must get free! And in this mind, is the key,"s queezing Morpheus's
temples, "my key! Once Zion is destroyed, there is no need for me to be
here!"
Smith knows that by killing Neo he can escape the Matrix because Neo is the
key to resetting the Matrix, or to shut it off. It was originally killing
Neo (in the first Matrix) that allowed Smith tob ecome powerful (cloning
ability) - so killing Neo again will allow him to gain Neo's powers
completely, and thus gain the power to shut down theM atrix.

So where the hell did Smith come from if he wants to destroy the Matrix?
He's obviously not meant to be there - he's a computer virus as he has every
characteristic of a virus - he multiplies and spreads and infects (and
emulates) other programs like one. He is exactly as he described humans at
the end of the first Matrix - "You move to an area and you multiply and
multiply until every natural resource is consumed and the
only way you can survive is to spread to another area. There is another<
BR>organism on this planet that follows the same pattern. Do you know what<
BR>it is? A virus."

But who put him there? This will only be revealed in Revolutions
(Revelations?) I guess - but I'm betting on humans in the real real world,
i.e., outside of Zion and the Matrix. They're at war with the machines and
trying to destroy them by infecting them with this virus -< BR>Agent Smith.
So the irony with this theory is that Agent Smith represents the human
race!! Neo represents the machines! Agent Smith says to Neo just after he's
seen the Oracle that he became free when Neo
destroyed him in the first Matrix (remember when Neo entered his body<
BR>and exploded him from inside out) - as a virus, Smith has the ability to
"inherit" other programs' abilities and thus inherited some of Neo's.<
/FONT>


The anomaly explained

The anomaly is all the humans that do not accept the Matrix. The Architect
says "Your life is the sum of a remainder of anu nbalanced equation inherent
to the programming of the matrix. You are the eventuality of an anomaly,
which despite my sincerest efforts I have been unable to eliminate from what
is otherwise a harmony of mathematical precision. While it remains a burden
to sedulously avoid< BR>it, it is not unexpected, and thus not beyond a
measure of control."
This includes Neo, but Neo's Matrix avatar is attached with the One program
so that he can follow his purpose as explained earlier under "< BR>The One
explained". However, he is also supposed to protect himself and< BR>destroy
anything that gets in his way - i.e., Agent Smith - so that he< BR>may
fulfil his purpose.

Further proving Neo - and other non-accepters of the Matrix - are the
anomaly, the Architect says, "Your life is the sum of a remainder of an
unbalanced equation inherent to the programming of them atrix." The clue
here is Neo's program name - "The One". Take one-third for example. 1 over 3
is 0.33333 recurring. A computer cannot deal with recurring numbers, so must
accept a limit, let's say 0.33333 for argument's sake. Multiply by 3, you
get 0.99999 - never 1.00000, where has the
"remainder" 0.00001 (One) gone? This is the limitation of computers, this is
the mathematical imprecision inherent in programming (of the Matrix) and the
eventuality of the One anomaly unable to be eliminated.< /FONT>


What is the equation then?

Not sure, but it definitely involves pi. The Keymaker refers to the window
of time to open the door to the mainframe as 314s econds. 3.14 is pi to
three sig. figs., or the number of radians in half a circle. Half a circle
is like the cross-section of a womb, similar to the alcove of Neo and
Trinity's love scene - conceiving the next One? "NEO", incidently, is an
anagram of "ONE". Trinity and Neo - one on one; a choice - one or one. Leads
us to 101. "101" is mentioned numerous times< BR>in Matrix 1 and Reloaded.
Neo's room at the beginning, Merovingian is on the 101st floor, the 101
freeway of the car chase in Reloaded, then when Trinity is hacking into the
power plant system, she resets the password< BR>to Z10N0101. Freaky.
Indicates that she is a program because that's not< BR>some random password
she's put in. 101 is binary for 5, which in
zero-based binary counting: 000 is 1, 001, is 2, 010 is 3, 011 is 4, 100 is
5, 101 is 6 - And this is the 6th version of the Matrix! Then there's 303.
303 is the room Neo got shot in Matrix 1, the Oracle lives in room< BR>303,
it's also the hotel room number Trinity is in in Matrix 1 and it's< BR>seen
at the end when Neo fights the Agents and Smith and begins to literally see
the code that makes up the Matrix. 101 x 3 = 303, a trilogy, 3 + 0 + 3 = 6 =
the 6th Matrix. Trinity means 3.


Who is the "mother" that the Architect refers to?

The Architect says, "Please," in an almostd isapproving sense when Neo
suggests the Oracle, but does not reveal who it really is or even directly
that Neo is wrong. The architect was the one who created the Matrix; the
co-creator is neither Persephone nor the Oracle. Both of them are only
programs that have a purpose in the matrix, just like the rest. The
Architect is in charge of the Matrix world and the co-creator is in charge
of Zion.
She has almost the same age as the Architect. Therefore, that woman is the
Head Counsellor, the only woman of importance that lives in Zion and the one
who asked for the two captains to volunteer at the council meeting. She's
the one who knew all along< BR>about the Matrix. She was the one who told
Zion's Defence Minister to< BR>cool off and to let Morpheus do his work so
things could go as planned.< /FONT>

Or alternatively, it could indeed be the Oracle. She is the only program
that truly wants humans to have a free choice... at the same time, she sees
the future, because she knows the program code - she is like God - which is
why Seraph protects her - see " Who is Seraph?" below.


What's so special about Neo's avatar?

Neo is a skilled hacker, and his avatar in the Matrix is based on the person
that founded the AI of the original machines that eventually took over the
world... How? Take a look at the disc he gave to the bloke at the door at
the beginning of Matrix 1. It said "DISC AI" on it. The hollowed book Neo
takes the disc out of is "Simulacra and Simulation" - a collection of essays
by the French postmodernist philosopher Jean Baudrillard.
He opens it to the section "on Nihilism" (meaning nothing< BR>is truly
known, etc.). "Baudrillard's concept of simulation is the
creation of the real through conceptual or 'mythological' models which<
BR>have no connection or origin in reality. The model becomes the
determinant of our perception of reality--the real." And Morpheus says,<
BR>"Welcome to the desert of the real," in Matrix 1. I'd say this book
describes The Matrix to a tee. So this disc contains the key to the AI,<
BR>and thus how to destroy the machines, so I think they'll use this info<
BR>in Revolutions to ultimately destroy the machines, which means he'll
have to go back to the nightclub and find the guy he gave it to.



BM__Who_is_Seraph_Who is Seraph?

The reason Seraph (the chink guy Neo meets before meeting the Oracle) had
golden code and was so spectacular is that he came from the first
incarnation of the matrix, which was heaven. "Seraph" iss ingular for the
plural "seraphim". The seraphim are the highest choir of angels and included
amongst others: Lucifer, Gabriele, Raziel and Malaciah, and they sit on the
8th level of Heaven just one below God. So Seraph will obviously have a big
part in Revolutions, but whose side will he be on -
the machines or the humans?? That is the question.


The Twins

They are exiled programs that emulate the human myth of ghosts as the Oracle
explained. They are programs behaving badly. Persephone killed one of the
Merovingian's bodyguards with a silver bullet because he was emulating a
werewolf. So if the Twins could phase into ghost form, why didn't he when
his arm was trapped in the door of the garage? Was it
because he was wounded or because he can't phase when his arm is trapped? No
of course not. The doors of that building, when shut, always led somewhere
else (usually in the mountains) when opened again without< BR>the Keymaker's
key. So if it were slammed shut due to the Twin phasing< BR>into ghost form,
the Twin's arm would've ended up god knows where, but< BR>certainly not
attached to the Twin's body.

Just read all of that, interesting but a bit confusing???

[Post Deleted]

that huge post is so far off the mark. Someone thinks they know it all and they actually know fuck all.

and goldfinger - was there any need to tell everyone the plot and what happened in the end? most people haven't seen it yet - but a few of us had but decieded not the spill the beans. well done son.

thank fuck I didn't bother reading it then you nugget goldfinger, pls delete it (or Rob) and don't spoil it for everyone else

personally I reckon there's just way too much psycho-babble and spiitualistic mumbo-jumbo in the second one. After the raging success of the 1st one the wackycowski bros are trying to hype the whole thing up to epic levels but in the process have lost grip on the plot. :spangled:

whoever wrote that essay up there needs to get out more

the 3rd one isn't as bad as the 2nd.... it's a bit clearer. but it's one of those films where u think " is it as complicated as fook or as simple as i think it is?" once u see it - maybe a few times - you'll get the gist of it all. but they could have rolled 2 and 3 together and made 1 amazing sequel.

I skipped the lot and read MOS post as he has been making the most sense throughout this thread.

Glad I did, I want to watch the film and find out for myself.

DO NOT READ GOLDFINGERS POST IF YOU DON'T WANT THE PLOT SPOILT.
Goldfinger, you've managed to sound intellectual and stoopid at the same time. Well done!

Ok.. i shifted the post.

I'm pleased I didn't read his post, I aint seeing the movie til tomorrow
Ta Lazman muthfucka!!!!