Faith schools

as i said though i havnt read it all but its a really good read lads well done good arguments on both sides and for once its not endded in a slaggin match of some kind :clap: :clap: :clap:


BTW your both wrong we're just a marble for aliens to play with like on men in black ha ha

I retract my last comment

I don't get my theory... I'm new to Judaic theory, its an alien concept to me - but as you say it makes a cracking read

because people can have a second tongue?

I'm learning hebrew and while I don't speak it perfectly, I'm surrounded by people that do

has joe admitted being wrong yet?

has anyone come close to proving me wrong?

about as close as you are being proved to be right?

I don't have to prove my theory... I cited a modorn orthodox perspective on genesis and was told I was wrong.

If someone is going to make that claim they need to be able to disprove my beliefs.... no one has come close.

I can prove it's bollocks by the simple reasoning that 1000000000 years is rather more than 1 day, translation vagueness included.

Also, even if we had accepted that the Jews had confused 1000000000 years and 24 hours, then there's the matter that they wrote events in past tense, that won't actually happen for another 1000000000 years.

Lots of holes in this one Joe, even by your standards

it states in the talmud (which goes hand in hand with the torah) that one day in genesis is not the same as one day now.... why are you trying to tell a jew what the Torah means?

Will you quit being an arrogant prick, there are countless examples of jews 1500 years ago (long before modern science and at a time when 6 day creation would seem possible) stating that the days are not the same.

You don't know Torah, you've never studied Torah, you can't read Torah... So will you quit trying to tell me what it means!

Furthermore, there's the small matter that says that the sun and moon appaeared on the 4th day, which is bollocks, as modern cosmological theory believes that the moon appeared long long after the sun, formed from asteroids.

Also, the sun, as the source of energy for all photosynthetic life (plants) couldn't possibly have appeared after them as forks quite rightly pointed out.

On the first day (of creation of the earth and sun, not the universe), if God wanted to tie things in with modern theory, he should have started with the sun. The he should have made the earth a billion years later, with the moon at some point in there. Then he should have added primordial slime a few hundred million years after that, and allowed it to form bacteria and viruses, which got their energy from chemicals. After this, he should have allowed them to evolve for a while and form plants. Then, long long after this, he could start thinking about animals.

Then it's time for the dinosaurs etc, the a few millions years later he can bump them off for reasons best known to Him.

After several more billion years, he can allow humans to evolve from primates, then it's time to start talking to them, studiously ignoring the other animals, which humans will reign over. He can meticulously document the above events, scribble it down on his bits of stone, and send them down from the heavens to be transcribed for future reference, careful to avoid ambiguity about '1 day' and '1 billion years'.

For a 'perfect being' G-d doesn't half know how to cock things up. But then that's what 'faith' is isn't it - an ability to look at all the rational arguments and decide they're all wrong and that you'd prefer to believe a book someone made up a couple of thousand years ago.

PS at you telling me to stop being 'arrogant'

Have you actually read anything I've wrote, I'm getting tired of repeating myself.

The modern atmosphere we experience would not of existed during day four it would of been carbon dioxide and water vapor, with some nitrogen... water vapour (or clouds) would of blocked out the the sun... with the arrival of the modern (third) atmosphere - the sun would of appeared.... which is what the fourth day states.

Do plants die when the sun filters through clouds? No.

LOL no he wouldn't, time expands; if he were to of made it billions of years later there would of been a trillion trillion year gap... this basic quantum physics andy.

Which is what happens the bible first describes life...

Why would g-d talk to the jews in a language they couldn't comprehend? The torah is wrote using hebrew words that were already in existence, it was wrote in a style that ancient man could understand... but that every generation from that day on could expand on - as science advances - so does our understanding of Torah.

Andy I'm sorry but you're a cunt.

You're not proving or disproving anything, you're coming across as a snotty nosed know it all... far greater minds than yours have pondered over religion - you're not bringing anything new to the debate.

You've never read torah, you don't understand torah, you're not proving or disproving anything... you're coming across as a cocky know it all making wild guesses in attempt to look smart.

I'm off to shul... consider your next post as your school boy arguments are incredibly irritating.

I'm not trying to disprove somehting i don't understand
I'm not trying to disprove someone in an attempt to look smart
I'm not the arrogant little shit.

thats load of shite u are u tyr 2 look smart all the time and proove people wrong and u spend hours googling things on the internet 2 do that which alot of people think is sad


u always disproove people in an attempt 2 be arrogant or just annoy

until u can proove anything that sticks about judaism, LIKE TRUE FACTS

i will always think u talk shit

am i right in saying that you once said that some of the torah dosnt have any litteral tranlation though ? so if your only just learning hebrew that means your first language is english so how will you learn these untranslatable passages if they cant be translated ? im not trying to catch you out it's just i dont understand how you'll be able to study all of the torah if you cant understand the whole script !!!

because I'm learning with rabbi's who help me with my translation, I am working from an authentic text and not a modern computer generated script.

me also

im learning with rabbi hershal krustovski

It's amusing and not too suprising that you are still being educated by cartoons.