On the subject of media bias in the Middle East....

On the subject of media bias in the Middle East....

...The whole world seems to have forgotten about Gaza and what's happening there.

Interesting article in todays Independent - not the last word in unbiased journalism itself, but the facts are difficult to contest, and raises some interesting issues about what consitutues a 'proportionate' response.

http://news.independent.co.uk/world/middle_east/article1372026.ece

Re: On the subject of media bias in the Middle East....

bet that won't stop Joe contesting them

Re: On the subject of media bias in the Middle East....

How can you call it unbiased when it makes comments like:

"More than 260 Palestinians, including 64 children and 26 women, have been killed since 25 June. One in five is a child. One Israeli soldier has been killed and 26 have been wounded."

Why are Israeli casualties carefully labelled military personel while the only named Palestinian victims are women and children?

It's an extremely biased article which ignores the circumstances in which civilian casualties manifest, while purposly going out of its way to brand Israel an evil entity.

Re: Re: On the subject of media bias in the Middle East....

The media bias I was referring to was the difference in publicity of civilian suffering in Lebanon, which seems to be similar to that of Gaza - which has recieved little other media attention.

How is it a bias? Its reported everyday and Israel is never portrayed in a fair light.

Re: Re: On the subject of media bias in the Middle East....

sooo do you think it is acceptable that 20% of the palestinian casualties are children?

or that in order

and under what circumstances is it acceptable to have such a high retio of civilian deaths

and all this in response to the kidnapping of 2 Israeli soldiers...

doesn't seem to be a very proportional response IMO

Re: Re: Re: On the subject of media bias in the Middle East....

Yes.

If Palestinian militants surround themselves with childrens then you cannot scream bloody murder when there lives are sadly lost.

Also, do you think Palestinian terrorist attacks differentiate between adults and minors?

A high civilian death toll?!?!?

Are you insane the region has been locked in war over 50 years and theres been less than 10,000 deaths - Sudan probably get through that many a year!

It is internationally recognised that Israel's enemies use human shields, civilian casualties are inevitable when they become an integral part of the Palestinian/Lebanese military machine.

Or the thousands of missiles fired into Israel - levelling northern towns (which wasn't shown on British TV).

But then you're a brain washed anti-zionist.

Re: Re: Re: Re: On the subject of media bias in the Middle East....

We're talking about Hamas, not Hezbollah in this thread please

How many Israeli civilians have died as a result of rocket attacks from Gaza, since the blockade was introduced?

You can't view the full article now.....pity.

Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: On the subject of media bias in the Middle East....

he's talking about 2 soldiers being captured.

Palestine is a completely different confict, its has little to do with the immidiate civilian casualties on the Israeli side but the long term threat of the Palestinian military.

Re: Re: Re: Re: On the subject of media bias in the Middle East....

You can, as the methods used by the Israelis (extensive use of cluster munitions, phosphorous armed weapons) are so indiscriminate as to be responsible

They don't. Does that justify a military response in kind? Certainly not. Unless you want the military prosecuted for the same crimes as the terrorists after.

Yes, it's fucking high civilian death toll. Just because it's low in apocalyptic terms doesn't make it acceptable as a long term situation in the Middle East.

Bollocks. Of course the terrorists operate in civilian areas - they're 'terrorists'.

Excuse to flatten civilians along with them? No.

If Israel took sufficient care in its military actions, you wouldn't see international condemnation of civilian casulties, condemnation from aid agencies, and even (this made me wryly chuckle) investigations from the US into misuse of weapons.

I await Amnestys forthcoming report with interest.

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Exactly, this is what makes the suffering of Palestinian people described in the artcile so inexcusable.

Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: On the subject of media bias in the Middle East....

Andy they're the standard munitions used in combat, we used them in Iraq.... Typical double standard anti-Israeli criticism.

But Israel don't target children, 20% reflects the the shields terrorists hide behind.

In the terms of prolonged war on several fronts it is one of the smallest death tolls on record, I can prove this if you want... if not bow out gracefully.

How else can Israel respond to attacks like this:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=gyHQFyO_fu4

If you have a military that purposely launches attacks on Israel from civilian infrastructure, they force Israel into a situation where they must neutralise that threat to preserve Israeli lives.

You're not living in the real world.

You're blinded by your anti-zionist stance, does the international community make the same noises about the coalition? Israel are surgical in their strikes, the Lebanese civilian death toll was so high because Hizbu'llah used so many human shields!

I don't.

Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: On the subject of media bias in the Middle East....

They're standard munitions in combat against enemy soldiers in wide open plains, and clearly unsuitable for use in urban areas.

It's not a case of not 'targetting' children, it's a case of taking sufficient steps to ensure they're not unduly harmed - this is international law. 20% represents a groteque failure to do so. Children make up 25% or so of the US population (I don't know the statistic for Palestine), so they're scarcely doing better than if they just hit people at random!

It's a way of life for the civilians of the region, and it's not acceptable as a long term situation.

A diplomatic package that reduces the documented civilian suffering, acknowledgement of the rights of Muslims to exist in a free and autonomous society. I have no qualms about the destruction of rocket launchers - but weapons so vast that they level the buildings near them are unecessary in a precision age.

My stance isn't anti Zionist - all I've ever opposed is the civilian suffering caused by Israel, and I've equally supported the prosection of terrorists. If this makes me a racist in your book.....you need a dictionary

PS - Israeli surgical strikes: They were warned 10 times in 1 hour by the UN about it's observers, they gave repeated assurances they would not be struck, then used a laser designator from the ground or air to illuminate the site of the observers, sent in a plane, authorised the release of the weapon, and killed all 4, without a Hezbollah launcher in miles.

If I did my surgery this indiscriminately, I wouldn't get very far (except perhaps in orthopaedics).

Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: On the subject of media bias in the Middle East....

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=nbOlqG2arSo

We were watching a different war

More double standards from you Andy.

The Palestinian birth rate is much higher than the US birthrate?!?!? More unresearched nonsense from you.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=KM35dzT9dUI&mode=related&search=

A great example of the use of human shields by Hizbu'llah, unfortunatly Israel can't simply take out the rockets (as they have thousands stock piled), they must also take out the terrorists and when the terrorists are behaving in the above fashion civilian casualties are inevtiable.

By the way why don't you make the same noise about Iraq where there is a far higher civilian death toll?

And the buildings surrounding the rockets rarely get hit, Israel's hits are surgical.

Then why single out Israel as a lone state? why devote days of research into proving the evils of Israel, who in global contexts have a tiny death toll, go out the way to help their enemies, seek peace at every oppertunity and are only ever acting out of defence?

http://www.canada.com/ottawacitizen/news/story.html?id=37278180-a261-421d-84a9-7f94d5fc6d50

When you have UN peace keepers sending emails stating that Hizbu'llah are using them as human shields, I find it amazing that you claim that there's no terrorists for miles? Do you know something the observers that died didn't?

http://news.bbc.co.uk/1/hi/uk/5319716.stm

haha scroll to the bottom: "In an earlier version of this story we mistakenly attributed comments to Dr MacShane about British Jews being the focus of anger as a result of Israeli and US foreign policy. We would like to make clear that Dr MacShane did not make these comments. We have amended the story accordingly and apologise for the error.".... Total freudian slip from the Israel bashing BBC

Just read the original quote in the Jewish Chronicle, the slimey bastards at the BBC misquoted their apology!

Sleazy fucks:

"British citizens who happen to be born Jews have to accept responsibility for the anger there is against Israel or America"!!!!

I hate the BBC.

do you really believe the bbc put that quote out like that? how come the jewish chronicle are not slimey bastards. Or are they the fount of all truth.
and whats wrong with being anti zionist?
surely it is true that jews everywhere are attacked (unfairly) because of the anger there is against not just the US and UK but against Israel? Is that not just a statement of fact. I know UK jews are not responsible for Israeli government actions any more than I am responsible for the actions of the Israelis but it is unquestionably true that racists use that as a stick to beat innocent Jews. That's all the BBC were saying.

Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: On the subject of media bias in the Middle East....

well heres a contradiction in terms i thought sorry i quote "the buildings surrounding the rockets rarely get hit, Israel's hits are surgical."

how did the manage to hit a UN post if the Hizbu'llah were setting up "nearby"