Traktor Vs Ableton I can see how traktor 1 and 2 were a bit 'fisher price' as DJ tools since they either didnt work properly, crashed all the time, didnt support decent hardware devices etc etc. But with traktor 3 right now, i cant see what the advantage is with ableton live as a DJ'ing platform, apart from ableton being able to support the ability to trigger loads of (pointless) loops and samples. Traktor 3 has 4 decks, Xone:92 emulation, beatgrids etc etc etc. ..... As a DJ'ing tool, isnt it time to accept that traktor is more DJ focused and addresses digital dj'ing and its needs than ableton does? Or does Ableton still have tons of fans simply because it looks confusing and unintuitive and is therefore 'cool' ?
traktor is designed specifically to emulate the traditional way of djing, with the addition of some of the things that the likes of ableton bring to the table ableton was not designed for this, but as one of its features, it can be used as a tool to dj with i've used ableton for over a year now and wouldnt dream of doing a gig with it however, ive used serato for 2 years and wouldnt dream of not i think people dj with ableton because they've seen sasha and van dyk do it. at the same time, they have both dropped further down the dj mag top 100 poll it doesnt help that both of these famous djs look boring as fuck without a laptop to stare at, and now they've made themselves look even more useless to watch. oh dear, i've started over-analysing again. sorry
Re: Traktor Vs Ableton ha ha mint, you've hit the nail on the head there. if a tool like that looks too simple - of course it must be shit
Re: Traktor Vs Ableton What point are you trying to make Brid? Technology changes, DJ's change the way they play. Who is anyone to say what is better than what. Someone who uses Ableton over traktor does so for a reason. Maybe they enjoy it more or feel they perform better or a certain bit of kit allows them to perform in a way in which the other doesnt. Ableton has tons of fans because its groundbreaking and allows people to combine production and DJ'ing like no other software. It never makes much sense to me why people blame Ableton for DJ's performing crap - it plays music like anything else - maybe those 2 (Sasha & PVD) dropping down the DJ poll has something to do with their styles not being as popular as they once were or the ammount of shit that has took over the poll?
i don't really give a fuck if someone is staring at a laptop screen or staring at a deck, as long as they are playing good music why does it matter what they use?
Re: Re: Traktor Vs Ableton not sure who blames ableton, but ive read a lot of times now people complaining about both sasha and pvd looking less involved with the crowd they are entertaining and more involved with trying to work the mouse - not the programs fault, more the user imo and, it plays music yes, but i think the difference in using ableton and a record or cd is that people can see what's going on a bit more - i think people have the idea that its all pre-made sets when they see someone using abes, or a laptop even as for my poll comment, that was just a side thought i had on the subject that i typed out, there was nothing serious in it i have only seen 1 person use ableton during a set and that was enferno, but i dont think either sasha or pvd come close to that skill level to make a comparison if its entertaining, it doesnt matter what someone uses, if its not, thats where all the bitching takes over. the internet is good for that.
I think a large part of why some of the more prominent laptop DJs, particularly PVD, have lost their way is the structure of their sets and some of the music they play. Something someone once said to me is still true in DJing: just because you can mix from one track to another doesn't mean you should. PVD has been panned for quickly swapping styles during a set with no flow or rythm to it. A good example of this is some of the DJs who play in and around the gate. I got dragged to mood a while back for a friends birthday and the DJ there went from house to RnB using ableton. The mix might have been perfect, but it sounded wrong and killed the mood (no pun intended). Mixing isn't the be all and end all of DJing (certainly not if you're playing commercial stuff in a bar or club week in week out). If it was we'd leave it to computers and remove the human completely. What's more important is how you read a crowd, how you structure your set, and what you play in what order. Just because you can mix from one track with a normal bpm of 120 into another with a normal bpm of 80 doesn't mean you should. I know when I mix live I think 3 or 4 tracks ahead of what I'm playing; I ask myself what would sound good after the current track, and what would sound good after that, and so on... The last two mixes juski has sent me have been done using a PC but not using ableton. He's used the software he's got to layer his set, he's got acapellas and samples all over the place, loops of one track, bits of another and it sounds great, but only because the tracks and sequences he picked fit well in the order he picked them. Thats how the technology should be used - to take music and rythm and do something clever with it, not just use it to mix tracks together that don't fit and wouldn't (and shouldn't) be mixed by choice via a pair of CDJs or decks.
Whether or not you believe in digital dj'ing and its failings and strengths, theres tools availble .... but the question is, is the current 'hip' tool actually that good. I mean, didnt ableton take off since it appeared to be really stable, had the funky 'warping' that allowed you to beatmatch anything and keep it in time for as long as you wanted, and seemed to be the only thing out there dependable enough to use in a live environment? Granted ive heard some great and entertaining things being produced from it ..... but of all the times ive bothered trying to learn ableton, ive come away thinking it felt like a total waste of time ..... and things like traktor are staring you in the face in how much more obvious they are as a dj'ing tool. Just wondering if things like traktor/serrato have come of age now, seeing as DJ's like Chris Liebing, Dubfire and Grandmaster flash use it professionally, and perhaps ableton isnt quite the great tool its been seen as...... ..... And Gabriel and Dresden should be banned from ever using ableton again.
your right there, Gab and Dres arent half as good as they used to be, although is that down to ableton - or have they just shifted styles? i'm jumping on the ableton/traktor bandwagon once i get my laptop and controller - but i doubt i'll be using outside my home. and i havent a clue how to use the fucker so i cant say anything else
not this thread again ffs My mate played at Backlash a couple of weeks ago, played something like 97 tracks in 60 minutes using Ableton and absolutely bounced it. He used to dj on vinyl but gave up because he physically couldnt mix the tracks in quick enough for how he wanted but now he can and it sounds fuckin mint. http://www.myspace.com/djblipmat Probably the best clubbing night out Ive had this year was when a club was so full of smoke that I couldnt see in front of my face for about 4 hours. I didnt have a clue when the warmup djs had finished and the headliner (Carl Craig) had started and the tunes were so good that it didnt matter that the bloke behind the decks was 'entertaining the crowd' by waving at them.
Nah i wouldnt say it was about digital dj'ing si .... more one about whether ableton is actually much cop compared to the competition in recent times. Sasha is a miserable sod behind the decks mind ..... although ive passed the phase of looking for my cues to enjoy myself from the DJ .... a bit.
your friends ghetto tech mix sounds like bad boy bill 10 years ago with his bangin the box series of mixes. he did them on 2 decks, but only about 60 tracks an hour. if you're in to that kind of sound, you should check them out, i think he did 5 altogether. your clubbing experience sounds familiar to those who spend £10 to get in to digital and then spend the rest of the night outside with the smokers. it doesnt matter who you pay to see, its the fact that you're there that's important. couldnt we then argue that if you just had a cd playing of brilliant music, we could just bypass hiring a named dj altogether and then not charge so much to get in these places? it seems that you dont need a dj or any of the things that go with hiring one, as long as you cant see and the music is good. the idea of a dj 'waving' at a crowd may sound amusing to someone who has seen it all before, and is maybe getting a bit bored with it, but as time goes by and new faces arrive, dont they deserve to see the things you once thought was 'entertaining'? just a thought.
Errrr no....im there to listen to good music on a good soundsystem in a good environment. If i wanted to go out to see my mates and have a chat I'd go to a pub. No because a good dj can see what is working or isnt working on the dancefloor and adapt accordingly. I dont need to see someone to enjoy their skill. Its music not football. If you reverse what your saying then how can you listen to a cd unless the artist is in front of you miming it. Im not really sure you are in a position to comment on my former tastes as you werent there.
Missed this one He plays everything from 2 seconds of a 90bpm hip hop track to 3 minutes of a 180bpm breakcore track over 3/4 channels so Ableton is perfect for him.
Ableton is well cool for loop based djing but there isnt really much benefit for 'traditional' 2 decks and mixer djing unless you cant beatmatch. I think the fact that its pretty easy to download for free has had a big bearing on its popularity. You have to pay upwards of £300 for Serato/Traktor. Although Ive read favourable reviews of this http://www.quadscratch.com/ which is £80 (you use your own soundcard)
